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Post by phantasman on Jan 6, 2015 3:07:33 GMT -5
19 And he smote the men of Bethshemesh, because they had looked into the ark of the Lord, even he smote of the people fifty thousand and threescore and ten men: and the people lamented, because the Lord had smitten many of the people with a great slaughter.
20 And the men of Bethshemesh said, Who is able to stand before this holy Lord God? and to whom shall he go up from us?- 1 Samuel 6
Do you believe God the Father killed 50,000 for looking into the "ark"? Is this "slaughter" murder? If God commands man not to kill, and he does kill, could he not lie, cheat and covet as well?
Or is Jesus telling us who the murderer truly is:
44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.- John 8
It's why I have trouble believing the OT books being the "word" of God.
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Post by rmcdra on Jan 6, 2015 10:18:59 GMT -5
This is probably why most Jews are atheist.
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Post by phantasman on Jan 7, 2015 13:23:37 GMT -5
I never saw it from that point of view. The Hebrews had their own god. The Philistines had theirs. A battle of gods, if you will.
Christ showed us a true God who was spiritual, one with all regardless of culture and physical heritage. It is why the Muslims follow a belief that the Hebrew god spoke to Muhammad, to continue as the feared god of Abraham. The Jews went on the wrong track. The Christians follow the wrong prophet.
We see a physical belief system, like the Hebrews, in place of a spiritual one. Today, the Philistines/Canaanites are still battling the Jews for who has the correct god. Meanwhile, Christians are caught in the crossfire. Understanding gnosis see's them all as they are (outer). None see what they need to see (inner/self}.
"It is not possible for anyone to see anything of the things that actually exist unless he becomes like them. This is not the way with man in the world: he sees the sun without being a sun; and he sees the heaven and the earth and all other things, but he is not these things. This is quite in keeping with the truth. But you saw something of that place, and you became those things. You saw the Spirit, you became spirit. You saw Christ, you became Christ. You saw the Father, you shall become Father. So in this place you see everything and do not see yourself, but in that place you do see yourself - and what you see you shall become."- Philip
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Post by friendofsophia on Jan 23, 2015 1:35:50 GMT -5
For me, I tend to think that its mostly historical fiction. I really don't think you could say that most Jews are athiests, however, there's certainly a large percentage that consider themselves "secular Jews" that would probably agree with the historical fiction view. Stories like this were probably written down after a long oral tradition. These "men of Bethshemesh" the Philistines, Caananites and the other OT peoples were probably vilified due to negative encounters with the ancient Hebrews. Maybe it went something like "Some Philistines just attacked us, where did they come from father?"..."let me tell you a story about the Philistines and how God dealt with them son". You take legends from any ancient culture and try to make them into literal history and its going to look pretty much the same way.
That's not to say that these mythical figures and names do not point to something real. If we're real honest with ourselves, we can relate a lot to the figure of the Demiurge. If we've ever been ignorant, vengeful, prideful......but had some warped sense of good intentions.... we can certainly recognize our own inner Yaldabaoth. I find if we are able to have compassion and forgiveness for the Demiurge figure in our own personal cosmology, then we can find compassion and forgiveness for that same aspect in ourselves and in others.
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